[Jurinjo]

Question Answered. Feel free to um...read if you feel like I guess.

IMPORTANT NOTE: I do not believe homosexuality is a sin! I seem to have confused people on what I need perspective on. I am at peace with God. But my parents still believe it is a sin. Therefore what I wanted help with is if the paper I printed out is a good one to give to my mother. Who is by the way a straight, conservative, headstrong woman who has known many gay people. I've met a few of them. I'm trying to get her to see my point of view (although agreeing is another thing altogether) and using the said paper to move through this phase of Loving me but never accepting me.

APOLOGY: Sorry it got long! D: I probably won't get any help from y'all now. u_u;;

Sooooo I figured the title would get everyone's attention to what my problem is. Truthfully I'm not gay but bisexual...just my tendency for guys is strong so finding a girl is...ANYWAY not entirely why I need your help! You can skip the story part. It's just to fill you in on details that may not entirely matter. All you need to know is that I am still a follower of Christ and I believe the bible does not condone homosexuality as we know it. This is what I need to tell my mom and I'm debating on the how.

Story
So my mom already knows about me. And so does my dad and step-father. None of them are cool with this. But have remained loving and are trying to stay faithful to the Lord. They will test me for being true to my faith as well since my sexuality tests them. I faltered to make clear that I'm still faithful and what I believe regarding God and homosexuality. Everything became muddled in emotion and stereotypes surrounding all thing homosexual, as well as what my mom has heard and seen about them from personal experience. Like "oh it's okay God will still love us!" She is right that is NOT AN OKAY EXCUSE. It made me angry but I was too emotional at the time to speak properly. If that excuse was okay with me. The soulforce link you'll be seeing soon was a glimmer of hope for me. But I couldn't just accept what that man was writing. I spent another month researching, reading both sides of the argument, reading the bible, and praying. Since coming out to my mother I've promised to review the argument of homosexuality to try and refute it (because I cannot spiritually accept something without logically accepting it first) and what I believe makes perfect sense [to me].

What I'm thinking of Doing
So I printed out the soulforce information I stumbled upon month's when I finally decided to face my fear of God's wrath and read closely into his word on homosexuality. It was horrific really. Anyways since it was part of my first step to discovering this hope and developing a healthy fear of the Lord again it felt appropriate to print it out. What I'm planning to do with it is sit down, and have a talk with my mother about the situation. In my head it goes something like this:

"I wanted to refute the homosexual argument but my I feel what I think is right. And I want to explain to you what I think. I DO believe in God and plan to follow him as a faithful Christian. Mom please read this. NO this does not say my whole entire opinion. When I couldn't take the fear anymore I found this online. It wasn't enough for me then to believe God could accept me either if I acted on my desires. So I did everything I could to learn more. Including praying and reading the bible. I want your acceptance. But I encourage you to argue with all his points. Do your own research on this point of view. I don't necessarily believe every evidence some sources will point out but I have come to my conclusion through research. I only ask you do the same. Then after some time- I want to have another discussion on the topic. But I still want to be here for you. Let's do it together?"

Okay long winded and I probably won't get so much out so I gotta rehearse a little on what I want to say before my emotions rob me of my voice.


My Request
Is This Resource okay to give to a straight person? How would one take it? Particularly one of strong Christian faith and convictions? Any thoughts and opinions you wish to share? PLEASE share.

[Pocket]

My brother is gay and we grew up in the church. Our dad walked out on us when we were young...so he surrounded himself if people who loved him for who he was. He was able to come out and still be loved by his church family.

I'd say a long with getting advice online from your friends, go to your church family for support.

[Espy]

Read through that and some of the webpage; will get back to this later when I'm not worried about getting to class on time...

[Fey]

From some of the comments you have made my first question is what denomination are you? This will help in presenting ideas in a way that are acceptable for your belief system.

I am no religious, so I cannot give you first hand faith or comments like that. But problems like this are why I am NOT religious, I cannot fathom why someone would follow a belief structure that tells them it's wrong to be themselves as they were created by the same deity they believe in. But, while I don't have faith I do have knowledge, and I've studied a lot. I might be able to offer information that will help in some way.

Having read the link you posted I think this is a very, very appropriate piece of literature to had to anyone, no matter their orientation. The presenter has a well thought out way of presenting the information, without force feeding you 'facts' or 'quotes'.

[Jurinjo]

@Espy: It's okay, have...fun in class? xD;

@Pocket: Well ties into the problem my family doesn't approve of homosexuality. Neither does my church I know this. And there is no way I can change it if I tried (and trust me I have).

@Fey: It can seem illogical and I've seen its followers' plethora hypocritical moments (even the best of the Christians). I follow this belief structure that I do because I truly belief in God- it's no more than a feeling he is there. Faith is like that and sometimes I feel the uncertainty is unfortunate.

Anyways I am protestant, I can't get any more specific than that.

[Pocket]

Are there any groups in your area? I mean I had a friend that talked about this youth group type thing that he went to now and again.

[Jurinjo]

M Club...but um no Christians amoung them. They've helped but I dunno about discussing with them what I am doing with y'all here. At least when questioned by my parents I can't say I told anyone. Not that I don't always keep in mind everyone online are real people. Just I can say no and sort of be telling the truth. Jurinjo is terrible at lying. ^-^;

[Pinkie]

We have gone through the same thing almost. I am bisexual to and for the longest time I strayed more strongly towards females then males. I am also a christian as well as my family. The day that I realized that...I guess you can say that I didnt care was the day that my church excomunicated a young couple for being gay. In that moment I lost faith in my church. Now dont get me wrong I still praise the lord and always will but there are people that frown upon the whole thing.

The bible does say that a relationship between same sex couples is wrong and that you will "burn in hell" for it and this frightend me alot until I went and talked to a youth paster at my old church and he told me something that made me think even more. He said "Yes it is true that god frowns upon the relations of a same sex couple but if you have accepted our lord into your heart and repent your sins heaven awaits you"

This made me think so much about everything. I finaly came to the conclution that if god does truely love each of his childeren with undying love nothing we do should deminish that love he has for us. I explained everything to my father who so happens to be a homophobe to...go me. He still does not agree but the whole family still loves and cares for me. Mind you it took a good couple years but it happened.

I truely think that if love is found why should something like age, race, or gender stop you from loving that person...Love is a weird and mysterious thing and we all find it in different places. Look at me now, moved out with the bf whos an atheist lol...

[Rumiel]

Technically the bible says nothing against homosexuality. Sodom and Gomorrah was only punished for the worship of false idols. The closest thing that it ever mentions is not to lay with a man as you would a woman but if you think about it women were property to men back then so maybe it meant not treating another man as your property.

[Jurinjo]

Was thinking of going to bed before checking. Thank you for your own testimony it's moving that they were able to accept you even if it took long. I know one person who's been excommunicated by both his Church and family unfortunately. I'm unsure of his faith =(

That kind of thinking occurred in me too. I might hurt your feelings but because I care about your soul. Maybe it is good enough to say "God will love me anyway" when you are truly repenting. But I don't see that as okay. You are using repentance as a tool like some legal loop hole. It's why I silently sat in self-loathing of my desires for years. It's wrong to treat God that way. If homosexuality is a sin then it is judged just as any sin. So let's say someone intentionally murders innocents but is always repenting. They will probably make excuses of necessity but God will provide (Matthew 6:25-34) Granted that's extreme but it's the same thing. Treating God's laws like a legal system and exploiting a perceived loop hole ain't good either.

I'm being kind of mean. I'm sorry...especially as one believer to another. I realize how I must sound I just really feel strong on this. Feel free to yell at me and call me out for anything I may have said since I'm not that great at expressing what's on my mind (what I've said so far could've been said more effectively in less words I'm sure). I recommend reading the link from my first post. What ever impression I have given you...I would love to hear a response. =)

[Jurinjo]

@Rumiel: Yup you are correct on the technicalities. I will share more.

The words translated mean male-prostitues anyways. I'm unsure of the original words for verse you're referring to but that quote is from the book of Leviticus. Everything in there though is addressed to the Israelites. So all of laws in the entire book of Leviticus are not for Christians born again in Jesus Christ (whom also talks of the laws in Leviticus but I think I should stop throwing verses around).

[Jurinjo]

EDIT: Dang it! I'm so Sorry! Be careful with the backspace buttons kids! I'm not entirely sure how I ended up reposting the post before my previous though.

[DarkForbidden-Love]

On this topic I have a little to say being both a Christian and pansexual. One, we are the Lord's creation, would he create a being that he must hate? The snake in Genesis even shows this point, God should have killed it for making us sin but he only limited its mobility. God will not hate us because of out gender preference, he loves every man amoung us. Two, some humans are homosexual at birth about .4%, I believe. Why create something that you hate? I know I'm being slightly redundant but it the same theory over and over with different types of support.

[Daring Scylla]

Originally Posted by DarkForbidden-Love

On this topic I have a little to say being both a Christian and pansexual. One, we are the Lord's creation, would he create a being that he must hate? The snake in Genesis even shows this point, God should have killed it for making us sin but he only limited its mobility. God will not hate us because of out gender preference, he loves every man amoung us. Two, some humans are homosexual at birth about .4%, I believe. Why create something that you hate? I know I'm being slightly redundant but it the same theory over and over with different types of support.

I have to agree really strongly with this.
Im about to get what may look really controversial, so please remember that whatever I say, i am not trying to be rude and i have nothing but respect for the lot of you. but I think that if God supposedly does not make mistakes, He would not have created something that, in His eyes, is inherently evil (homosexuality). every christian is given the opportunity to repent, every christian is given the opportunity to love God. He might not necessarily like homosexuality, but He would not make humans and Himself suffer by sending to hell people who He loves and who love Him. I think that calling that a 'loophole' is not so much offensive (though it is) so much as it's silly. God wouldn't have put that there and given us the free will and intelligence to find that "loophole" without a reason. He works in mysterious ways, according to Christians.
Another thing to consider is that the Bible is supposedly "God's word" but it was written by men, who at the time may have been very conservative. This is not meant to offend anyone, but it's quite possible that things by men and men only found their way into the Bible.
As a gay male who was raised in a conservative setting, i receive nothing but abuse from my family, with the exception of my brother. I overcame it, and still haven't turned my back on God. that not only says something about my faith, it says something about God's love for me - he's never turned away from me even though I'm far from perfect in light of this subject.
I don't think I'm using it as a "loophole" so much as I find it really hard to accept that a merciful and loving God who loves me and who I love will send to hell because of one reason.
this is a real problem for you though, and I hope that whatever solution you find works for you. It's not easy to be gay and Christian at the same time, I know, and I hope you find resolution and peace for it. I'll be praying for you.

[Jurinjo]

Does everyone know what i want perspective on? I am at peace with God. I do not believe homosexuality is a sin....AT ALL. We are clear on this point correct? ^-^;

Thank you for your opinion Daring. Although I can't entirely say I agree with most of it. It does make sense where you're coming from.

I agree with your point DarkForbidden. Of course people will believe it is a choice. Or that the temptation exists like any sin of the body and that is must be resisted. The latter is my mother's belief. Also that it is entirely tied into my lacking relationship with my earthly father. Oh and she blames herself. I got dangerously volatile emotions to work with.

[Daring Scylla]

You are certainly allowed to have your own opinion, it's part of being human. I understand you want perspective, and i tried to give it by giving you my testimony and my personal opinion. This is a provocative issue, and I appreciate your attempt to be diplomatic and intelligent about it. still, good luck, and i'll continue praying that you find peace.
by the way, i normally go by Scylla ;]