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Suzerain of Sheol 09-25-2015 02:55 AM

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Originally Posted by MyPerfectPigeon (Post 1663349)
Do you think it's natural for humans to consider ourselves as a species more important than other things? What are your opinions on extremist religions that value other life so much, practitioners sweep the walkway before them to avoid harming insects?

I couldn't honestly tell you. If I ever had the opportunity to speak with a member of such a religion, I'd have a some questions for them, I suppose. But extremism by its nature isn't representative of anything but itself. I'm sure you'd have to examine the specific circumstances in how those belief systems came about, and even then, I wonder if a person who operates in such a way could even have a meaningful conversation with someone of my persuasion, or if the two philosophies are so incompatible that nothing of value could be derived.

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Would the agi's alleged morals be programmed by us or learned somehow by observation?
Do you think it would be irresponsible to make such a being, as it isn't implausible that it can rule other civilizations, forcing human morality onto them?
That is a far more practical question than accounted for in the thought experiment I laid out, and probably a far more interesting (read: disturbing) topic for our near future. I'd say that's a perfectly valid concern. I think Sam Harris brought that up in his talk, too, how you wouldn't exactly want, say, the representatives of genocidal regimes on the United Nations to have a say in the programming of the hypothetical intelligence in question.

Lawtan 09-25-2015 07:48 AM

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Originally Posted by Suzerain of Sheol (Post 1663388)
I wonder if a person who operates in such a way could even have a meaningful conversation with someone of my persuasion, or if the two philosophies are so incompatible that nothing of value could be derived.

I highly respect those belief systems where people value other life above human convenience. I wouldn't think that they would be too dissimilar to the imperative of supporting a superior moral intelligence that may decide to eradicate mankind. Certainly neither favors human as special or superior, but both see humanity as having a function or role. (Though, "fluffiness" can be a thing here...sort of like "softness" of science fiction)

Suzerain of Sheol 09-25-2015 06:16 PM

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Originally Posted by Lawtan (Post 1663390)
I highly respect those belief systems where people value other life above human convenience. I wouldn't think that they would be too dissimilar to the imperative of supporting a superior moral intelligence that may decide to eradicate mankind. Certainly neither favors human as special or superior, but both see humanity as having a function or role. (Though, "fluffiness" can be a thing here...sort of like "softness" of science fiction)

I'll confess I'm not terribly familiar with those faiths, nor even which particular ones we're talking about. Jainism is one, yes?

Perpendicular to that topic, though, I also meant to mention the... I don't know about similarity, but overlap of the concept of Nirvana and liberation from Samsara (I know very little about this, correct me if I'm abusing these terms) with the pessimist/nihilist view on the banality of human consciousness. On at least a basic, conceptual level the self-annihilation spirituality of those systems seems at least in a nearby framework (1) to the positions like mine that hold the current state of evolved human self-awareness to be an unnatural malady that should be abrogated from nature.(2)

1. It is possible I am grossly ignorant of the nuances of Buddhist, Jainist, and other associated belief systems.

2. That is not to say I am in favor of anyone being forcibly removed from existing, only that the idea of essentially breeding ourselves gradually out of existence is not the worst possible future I can imagine.

On another note of far-flung transhumanism, something I never really see discussed alongside stuff like AGI and mind-uploading is hypothetically being able to use such technology to FIX consciousness, and maybe repair us to such a degree that the way we actually are resembles what our intuitions would have us believe we are. I'm not sure how clear that is, now that I've typed it. I wonder what conscious existence of that sort would even be like. It might just be too paradoxical to both science and philosophy to even be able to discuss, though.

CupcakeDolly 10-07-2015 02:06 AM

It looks like I'm a little late to the party on this one, buuut...

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1. What religions do you find to be strange?
All of them. I understand the concept of most, and the general need for a sense of community, creating a purpose for oneself, and having someone to credit/blame for the creation of existence. What I find strange is that all of these people choose to put labels on themselves and nitpick about the specifics of their deities instead of realizing that they're all really just striving for the same thing.
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2. What religion (if any) do you conform to and why?
The religion of... Keeping it cool, I guess? It's fun to speculate about a higher being, but the very nature of such a thing would prevent us from fully understanding it anyway. Without going into too much detail, there are issues much closer to home that I'm more concerned with.
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3. Do you believe that there is a true path?
Reason, respect, empathy, and always striving to be better than you are without bringing anyone else down along the way. Granted, my actions don't always reflect those ideals, but...... shut up.
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4. What is different from the religion in question one and your own religion?
Seemingly everything.
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5. Do you have any interest in learning about religions? Why or why not?
Sort of, in the same way that I'm be interested in reading fairy tales. In most places the bible reads like a longer, more fiery version of Aesop's Fables with a lot of recurring characters, so that's pretty fun.


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